CR: 12 Models Lose CR Recommendation Over Car Reliability

Car/truck/automotive news and discussion
kevm14
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Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:28 pm

Re: CR: 12 Models Lose CR Recommendation Over Car Reliabilit

Post by kevm14 »

Here's an article on turbo engine reliability. The chart is interactive and shows what engine is under each dot.
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turbo engine reliability.pdf
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kevm14
Posts: 15200
Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:28 pm

Re: CR: 12 Models Lose CR Recommendation Over Car Reliabilit

Post by kevm14 »

This is the Bio for the guy who did the brand reliability ranking one:
I owe my career to two fateful events: my father buying a 1965 Corvette and my purchase of an Audi A4 rather than a Chevy Tahoe. The Corvette jump-started my love of cars, and the Audi led me to automotive journalism, track days, and amateur car repair. In my free time I cycle as much as possible, no matter the season.
Yes, I am sure Audi led him to a significant amount of car repair.
bill25
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Joined: Thu Oct 31, 2013 2:20 pm

Re: CR: 12 Models Lose CR Recommendation Over Car Reliabilit

Post by bill25 »

the Charger sedan improved to better than average,... The Challenger coupe had problems with the transmission. The Durango and Journey SUVs had multiple problem areas. All three remained below average.
So the Charger is above average and the Challenger is below average. I thought they were basically the same. They have different transmissions?
bill25
Posts: 2583
Joined: Thu Oct 31, 2013 2:20 pm

Re: CR: 12 Models Lose CR Recommendation Over Car Reliabilit

Post by bill25 »

CR lacks data to rank Alfa Romeo, Fiat, Jaguar, Land Rover, Maserati, Mitsubishi, or Smart.


Too bad they couldn't put those brands in, because I think they would ALL rank below Cadillac.
That isn't really much to brag about...LOL
kevm14
Posts: 15200
Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:28 pm

Re: CR: 12 Models Lose CR Recommendation Over Car Reliabilit

Post by kevm14 »

bill25 wrote:
the Charger sedan improved to better than average,... The Challenger coupe had problems with the transmission. The Durango and Journey SUVs had multiple problem areas. All three remained below average.
So the Charger is above average and the Challenger is below average. I thought they were basically the same. They have different transmissions?
Welcome to CR. Again I think they try to conflate "happiness" or overall satisfaction with the brand with "reliability." And I think there is a core CR reader that totally believes that. So literally any nuisance that you could vaguely put in the "reliability" category gets attributed as a reliability issue. I guess I'd play devil's advocate. Think of a hypothetical customer who has a car that has one or more of the following:
- Has a torque converter issue with the trans
- Has another mechanical transmission issue
- Has shift quality issues
- Has other software problems relating to the powertrain
- Has a recall relating to whatever nonsense electronic shifter the vehicle may have (FCA)

How much do they care what the issue is, when this is just ANOTHER trip to the dealer for a multi-day stay while they screw around flashing new calibrations (best case) or R&R the trans to replace the torque converter?

As a used car buyer, software issues almost don't matter at all because by 100k or whatever, they are going to have been ironed out for the most part. I don't even care about a problem under warranty, even a terrible problem that may have required full engine replacement (we're talking full black mark CR ratings here), if that problem was actually corrected by the time I get my hands on the car.

And that brand ranking is very much contemporaneous with specific model issues. I think things shift around all the time. Of course, used that way, the brand ranking is almost completely meaningless, because the individual model information is the only thing that could possibly help. Again, I cynically look at CR and think the typical reader is like "good, still Toyotas for me, no need to try something else."

I feel like my independent research is better than what I can get from CR. I just have this feeling that even though they have a lot of data points (though in some cases, very few), they are all coming from a non-diverse demographic. And that diminishes the value.

I would love to see what a CR survey looks like. I mean, what data do they actually collect? Surely the owners are not writing technical papers about the issues with their vehicles. It is probably MUCH more like "how many times did you take the vehicle into the dealer for non-maintenance last year? 0? 1-5? 6-10? More than 10? Fill in the following areas that best describe the type of problems you were having." Remember, there are lies, damned lies and statistics...
kevm14
Posts: 15200
Joined: Wed Oct 23, 2013 10:28 pm

Re: CR: 12 Models Lose CR Recommendation Over Car Reliabilit

Post by kevm14 »

bill25 wrote:
CR lacks data to rank Alfa Romeo, Fiat, Jaguar, Land Rover, Maserati, Mitsubishi, or Smart.


Too bad they couldn't put those brands in, because I think they would ALL rank below Cadillac.
That isn't really much to brag about...LOL
Yeah. I mean I was half joking. I'm like, man, how can Cadillac really be last? Then I saw those brands and was like....oh, they probably aren't actually last.
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