What's a good appliance these days?

[kevm14]

I watched this: https://youtu.be/hk2TfF1M4r8

The most interesting part was this:

appliance parents.png

If this is really the current players that is very valuable. I care because I am about to buy a new oven/range, dishwasher and microwave.

I wonder if Bosch is a safe choice.

I was surprised to see Fisher & Paykel under Haier, a Chinese company. So I looked at the wiki.

Fisher & Paykel (/ˈpaɪkəl/) is a major appliance manufacturing company based in East Tamaki, New Zealand.

Oh, New Zealand. Cool. But wait.

In 2012, Haier, a major Chinese white goods manufacturer, purchased over 90% of Fisher & Paykel Appliance shares

Le sigh. Not that Haier is automatically bad I guess. I will have to do some research. I think reliability is going to be among my top criteria (unlike with cars).

It would also be prudent to mention that being from the same parent does not necessarily guarantee reliability results. Kind of depends if it is systemic and if that thing is common to all child companies. Blanket statements need not apply. Honestly I should probably pay for a CR subscription, at least temporarily.

Oh, and what I learned from the video about appliances themselves:
- Fridge condensate drains clog and makes a mess. Not much else was said, but this is pretty basic and you'd think they could get that right (considering some refrigerators have f'ing touch screens on the front). I am not buying a fridge.
- Ovens and dishwashers seemed to need electronics.
- Microwaves are much cheaper so I am less worried but will still do my research. They were not mentioned in this video.

The thing that really galls me is that the price of electric board replacements is COMPLETELY unreasonable. Electronics are probably some of the cheapest things in an appliance yet the replacement part prices are astronomical. I would bet a 10x markup is possible. That's just bullshit. I mean, I drive older cars - if something is going to break, it better at least be affordable to fix. I don't want to service brand new appliances, honestly, for 10-20 years but if I need do, tracking down a $450 circuit board does not appeal to me in the slightest.

[kevm14]

Electrolux
Country of HQ: Sweden
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electrolux

Anova Applied Electronics, Inc.,[22] provider of the Anova Precision Cooker[23][24]
Electrolux ICON, premium consumer appliance brand sold in the US[43]
Eureka, American consumer vacuum cleaner brand[44]
Frigidaire, major appliance manufacturer.
Gibson, refrigerator and air conditioning manufacturer[45]
Philco, former U.S. consumer electronics and appliance manufacturer for appliances, though brand name is also used separately for electronics by Philips
Sanitaire, commercial product division of Eureka
Tappan, former U.S. appliance manufacturer
White-Westinghouse, former U.S. appliance manufacturer

Interesting, I wouldn't have guessed some of those. The fridge I got from Bryan is a Frigidaire. Now that I think about it I think I did see an Electrolux label somewhere on it.

[kevm14]

Haier
Country of HQ: China
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haier

In June 2005, Haier made a bid to acquire Maytag Corporation, backed by private equity funds Blackstone Group and Bain Capital. The bid was for USD $1.28 billion, or $16 per share, topping a previous offer of $14.26 per share made by Ripplewood Holdings.[10] In the end, however, Maytag was bought by Michigan based Whirlpool Corporation which offered $1.7 billion in cash and stock, or $21 per share, plus assumed debt.[11]

As of 2008, Haier had surpassed rival Whirlpool as the world's top refrigerator producer in terms of sales, according to Euromonitor, an independent business intelligence provider. Haier said it sold 12 million refrigerators worldwide, up 20% over the previous year. Its market share reached 6.3% globally.[12]

In 2012, Haier Group bought the New Zealand appliance manufacturing company Fisher & Paykel.[13]

In January, 2016 Haier Group acquired General Electric's appliance division for $5.4 billion.[14]

Criticism and controversies[edit]
In 2014, Haier was accused by German media of delivering smartphones and tablets with pre-installed malware.

Ugh. I threw in that last part because China. See also ZTE...but I digress.

So if I have this right, we have:
- Fisher & Paykel
- GE appliance (oy)

From a strictly consumer standpoint (as opposed to national security), I think China's industrial strength actually supports buying these companies (and their IP) and continuing to manufacture and improve. I think that is their strength as an industrial base. So take that for what it's worth.

Fun fact: Electrolux tried to buy GE appliance but the deal fell through (obviously).

GE Appliance may be owned by Haier but it technically is headquartered in Kentucky.

[kevm14]

LG
Country of HQ: South Korea

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LG_Electronics

Unlike the other brands, LG seems to pretty much market by their name.

Fun fact: LG used to stand for Lucky-Goldstar back in the day. The newer slogan is Life's Good.

[kevm14]

Samsung
Country of HQ: South Korea

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samsung

Kinda the same deal here as LG.

Fun fact: Some of the chips inside of my old Samsung plasma are made by Panasonic.

[kevm14]

Bosch
Country of HQ: Germany

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BSH_Hausger%C3%A4te

Possibly familiar sub-brands: Siemens and Thermador.

Fun fact: I am wondering if Bosch may actually be the brand I have already chosen for a dishwasher.

[kevm14]

Whirlpool
Country of HQ: US

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whirlpool_Corporation

This is the big one that most people are actually referring to when they say things like "most stuff is made by the same company now" or whatever. Behold:

The company markets Whirlpool, Maytag, KitchenAid, Jenn-Air, Amana, Gladiator GarageWorks, Inglis, Estate, Brastemp, Bauknecht, Indesit, and Consul. Whirlpool Corporation is the world's largest home appliance maker.[5] Their website also mentions Hotpoint, Diqua, Affresh, Acros, and Yummly brands.[6]

Now this is interesting:

In the U.S., Whirlpool has nine manufacturing facilities: Amana, Iowa; Tulsa, Oklahoma; Cleveland, Tennessee; Clyde, Ohio; Findlay, Ohio; Greenville, Ohio; Marion, Ohio; Ottawa, Ohio; and Fall River, Massachusetts.

That would be cool if they didn't have the worst reputation (I should qualify that but this is my guess). Sadly they own once-hallmark brands as Kitchen Aid and Jenn-Air.

[kevm14]

Kenmore

This isn't a real company but I threw it in here because I wanted to point this out:

As of 2017, Kenmore products are produced by manufacturers such as Whirlpool, LG, Electrolux, Panasonic, Cleva North America, and Daewoo Electronics. The brand is controlled by Sears Holdings, and owned by KCD IP, LLC, a special purpose entity created by Sears Holdings for securitization purposes. The name "KCD IP" is an abbreviation for Kenmore Craftsman DieHard intellectual property.

List of common Kenmore Manufacturers[edit]
Whirlpool Corporation
LG Corporation
Electrolux
Panasonic
Cleva North America
Daewoo Electronics

So there you go. If there was ever anything trustworthy about Kenmore (and there may have been), it would have been because of their design, not the company who made their appliances for them, most likely. Or, it had everything to do with the company who made that particular model...either way, Kenmore doesn't make anything. But they may design, which is quite important anyway. I don't know if stuff is just rebadged or a truly different design. If it is the latter, then the brand can somewhat stand on its own.

[kevm14]

I am doing the $8/mo subscription until I buy my appliances, which will happen no later than early Sept.

Yeah I think Bosch has figured out dishwashers.

Samsung is the most repair-prone brand of dishwasher. Bosch is among the more reliable brands of dishwashers. GE and Frigidaire are more repair-prone than Bosch, Whirlpool and Miele. Due to estimated failure rates, Samsung cannot be recommended by Consumer Reports at this time. That’s what we found when we asked 42,108 readers who purchased a new dishwasher between 2012 and 2016 about their experiences. Our statistical model estimates failure rates for two-year-old dishwashers not covered by a service contract. Differences of fewer than 5 percentage points aren’t meaningful. Models within a brand may vary, and changes in design or manufacturer might affect future reliability. Still, choosing a brand with a good reliability estimate can improve your odds of getting a dependable model.

dishwasher brand ratings.png

Although I scrolled down to the first Whirlpool in the list, which scored a 79. Noise is an issue they mentioned. But the CR reader review ratings were higher than either Bosch or Kitchen Aid! I don't know why noise is a major priority - a quiet dishwasher is cool if your living room is 5 feet from your kitchen, but if it's not, I don't care. I am sitting probably 50 feet from my dishwasher as I type this. I think quiet may translate to poor cleaning. I associate noise with strong jets of water and stuff like that. So if that is the tradeoff, I will make it.

[kevm14]

And here's the deal with ovens.

While no brand can be called out as manufacturing the best or least reliable electric range, GE has the lowest estimated breakage rate and is meaningfully better than LG. That’s what we found from the feedback of 10,738 subscribers who purchased their electric ranges new between 2011 and 2016.

Our statistical model estimates breakage rates (ranges that break or stop working as well as they should) for electric ranges by the third year of ownership. Differences of fewer than 6 percentage points are not meaningful. All ranges in our analysis were purchased new, not covered by a service contract, and adjusted for days of use per week. Due to a change in our methodology, our reliability estimates are not comparable to previous years (i.e., estimates based on instances of repair or serious problems). Models within a brand may vary, and changes in design or manufacturer might affect reliability. Still, choosing an electric range from a less breakage-prone brand can improve the odds of getting a reliable model.

oven brand ratings.png

Interesting. My generalization about Whirlpool earlier appears to be wrong if CR is anything to go by. They are 2nd best for both ovens and dishwashers.