Repair-It

I disagree. It is the whole package for the Camaro. Sure it is benefitting from the alpha chassis, but that is not everything, or a fault. The suspension is still different, the tuning is different for the driving modes, ride height, etc. The auto mags are not going crazy for The ATS-V alpha because of it's packaging (Turbo 6 vice 8), or the CTS-V alpha packaging (same drivetrain as the ZL1 but more weight and size, and 100K), they are constantly talking about how awesome the Camaro is as its price. (SS and above) Both Cadillacs are good no doubt but what you get for 63K with the ZL1 is insane.

And, I think you have completely lost it. The 2017 Corvette Grand Sport starts at $66,445, 3K more than the ZL1, has 2 seats instead of 4 (I can take my family in the ZL1 for a while, definitly can't do that with the Corvette, and the ZL1 has 200HP more.

So for more money, the Corvette has 2 less seats, and 200 less HP how is that better? Maybe in extreme circumstances it might be slightly better on a track, but I bet the Camaro is better everyday.

1) I agree as a daily driver type car, the Camaro is probably going to work better than a Corvette, but really only because of very occasional back seat use. The Corvette actually has significantly more cargo space. Actually more than the CTS-V.

2) Cars aren't just about drag racing (or hp/$). From a sports car standpoint, I believe the Grand Sport will still emerge as the superior car, even though it is slower. Not unlike Chevy SS vs Charger 392. That said, it is very good that they are right with the Hellcat stuff now in acceleration, and light years ahead in other performance metrics.

3) I agree the Camaro has more offerings/models than the ATS does. The ZL1 is significantly higher performing than the ATS-V with about the same base price. The difference is, I don't characterize that difference as "because the Camaro is awesome." Alpha + LT4 + good chassis tuning = a very high performing car, regardless of what it looks like or what the badge says. I would like it equally as much if it had different styling and/or a different name. The CTS-V is extremely high performing, while offering a decent amount of comfort and space, for under $100k. All things equal, I would much rather have a CTS-V3 than a ZL1 for my Alpha + LT4 package (if I'm being honest, I don't know that I need a manual transmission with 125 mph trap speeds). Despite being a pretty small car, the ZL1 is only ~250 lbs lighter than the CTS-V3. Put it this way - do you think adding one "Engineer" to the ZL1 completely ruins its performance? I would only be looking at something like this used, and the $24k gap in new car price will likely shrink in the used marketplace. On the other hand, the Grand Sport is 455 lbs lighter than the ZL1 which will be noticeable.

4) I still can't get behind a 2 door car like this. I could never understand actually using something like this as a daily driver, so I am going to have an actual daily driver if I ever had something like this. And if that's the case, the Grand Sport or something without actual rear seats is totally in the running.

5) We should be thrilled that this is likely to totally upset the GT350R, for far less transaction cost. The problem is, it doesn't have the hype or Shelby name. And to be fair, I could see someone (even like Bob) who would gladly take the engagement and thrill of the Voodoo over a ZL1 because they are both plenty fast for the street. So the ZL1 will be available at MSRP or less, while the GT350R still commands significant markup. I guess I shouldn't be complaining because for the price difference, I sure as hell wouldn't bother with the GT350R. Going further, the GT350R is the one you really want (i.e. the GT350 doesn't cut it) - the carbon fiber wheels are a key component in making that car what it is. Otherwise it is a thrilling engine and MR shocks. I could not see the case for the GT350 or lower. Side note, let's see if Ford can do ride/handling like GM without MR shocks. They are where GM was like 8 years ago in some ways. My evidence is reviews of the 2009 CTS-V in late 2008 - the overall chassis tuning enabled by the MR shocks vaulted that car to a league above its competitors (the LSA didn't hurt either).

I have become much less enthusiastic about 2 door cars as daily drivers since having kids. I just can't see doing a daycare drop off (now part of my daily routine) with a Camaro. I would much rather have the VSport or ATS-V (or a CTS-V3 like one parent at my daycare has).

We should be thrilled that this is likely to totally upset the GT350R, for far less transaction cost. The problem is, it doesn't have the hype or Shelby name.

I do agree with this. This car should have been called a more known name like IROC-Z or Z/28 Or IROC Z/28. Honestly, even if they top this, it will be forever unattainable for me so I almost don't care. This ZL1 is awesome, I wish it had a better name. The gen 5 ZL1 was good, but not iconic. This Camaro deserves to be iconic.

Some info on ordering a ZL1 right now.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yC2iXHZZ5mI