Kia Stinger GT

[kevm14]

HA

Comment number 1 in backfires:

12.9 at 111 mph out of a rear drive 4004 lbs car with a claimed 365 hp and 376 tq?? It's either underrated by 10-12% or this pre-production model is a ringer they gave out to journalists to use so they'd get great numbers to increase it's sales when it goes on sale. I'd like C&D to retest a production model to get it's times, if they can closely reproduce those numbers in similar conditions on the same track, then this car is underrated in the power department. If not, it was yet again another deceiving game that an automaker did with the pre-production model.


**Edit: After perusing a few stats in the luxury car comparison test C&D referenced, the Stinger got the exact same 1/4 mile time as the Cadillac CTS VSport that weighs almost identical in weight to the Stinger, also has 8 speed auto, similar overall gearing, but the Cadillac has 420 hp and 430 lbs ft of torque. And in the "top gear" rolling acceleration the Stinger even out accelerates the CTS by a smidge.

Another example is the Chevy SS sedan. It also achieves the same 12.9 @111 mph times with a 415 hp V8 in a car that weighs about 50 lbs lighter than the Stinger.

So again, this pre-pro Stinger is a ringer that the production models won't replicate, or Kia is vastly underrating this car's power output by the 10-12% I suggested above.

I thought of these same cars to compare with.

[kevm14]

Again, the Stinger supposedly is as fast as the Cadillac CTS VSport even though they weigh nearly identical, both have 8 speed autos with similar overall gearing, but the CTS has 55 more horsepower and 54 lbs feet of torque more. Normally that would make a quite notice difference in acceleration.

As stated pretty sure the Stinger is underrated by 10-12% or this pre-production model is a ringer intended to impress the auto journalists even more for positive write ups. This way if the production models don't perform as well, Kia has a legal cover: "well the one you all tested was a pre-production model, we made some last minute changes for production models in the name of longevity....blah blah."

Don't get me wrong if the car is really underrated by 40-50 hp and tq, so be it, that's great.

Dyno tests from eventual owners will show that if that is the case, but I'll wager future tests of this car won't replicate these acceleration times.

I'm betting more on the 13.3 @108 mph times

And I'm guessing 13.5 @ 105.

[kevm14]

Looky looky.

http://www.motortrend.com/news/kia-stin ... -finalist/

Stinger GT RWD: 13.5 sec @ 105.5 mph

Stinger GT AWD: 13.6 sec @ 104.8 mph

And my favorite part: AWD adds 142 lbs and in most cases, decreases performance. Literally everything is slightly worse, not better. Including 0-60. Now if this was a manual trans that you could clutch dump at redline, I'm sure the 0-60 of the AWD would have dipped into the 4s. Remember that next time you see amazing numbers from an AWD manual trans car. Because in the real world, it hurts performance. Except on crappy surfaces of course. But who's racing off lights in the rain anyway?

[kevm14]

i know of at least two instances (by the same magazine, no less) in which the handling results were not repeatable:

first, i'll see your quoted .90/.91g skidpad figures & 25s flat figure-8, and raise you a .85g skidpad avg coupled with a baby royal flush 26.2s figure-8 by the same magazine. 26.2 sec puts the stinger in pretty mundane company.

http://www.motortrend.com/cars/kia/stin ... st-review/

mundane company like just slightly faster around a 1.6 mile track than a fiat abarth. randy pobst says the kia has "a strong engine, strong brakes, soft suspension - it's not a track car but a nice sporty sedan" with "strong understeer" which is featured prominently throughout the video as you listen to tires screeching from beginning to end

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tSWQTkbTYIQ

not saying this wouldn't be fun to drive with some serious power down low, but don't try and make it out to be ruf porsche or something. instead, try again.

I will admit I am suspicious about this car, so if there is even a hint of shenanigans I'm going to perk up.

[kevm14]

They got better fuel economy with the AWD one. Figure that out.

The gist of what I'm seeing is these cars are all over the map. I don't know if it is production variation or if something more sinister is going on. Hyundai/Kia have a little history with this kind of thing, especially with turbo engines. So that also makes me suspicious.

I would bet a small sum that a regular production version does not run that 12.9 @ 111 though.

In fairness, everyone is talking about that 108 trap from the Civic Type R as another ringer, so it's not that this is exclusive to Hyundai/Kia.

[bill25]

I thought of these same cars to compare with.

Yes you did.

[Bob]

HA

Comment number 1 in backfires:

12.9 at 111 mph out of a rear drive 4004 lbs car with a claimed 365 hp and 376 tq?? It's either underrated by 10-12% or this pre-production model is a ringer they gave out to journalists to use so they'd get great numbers to increase it's sales when it goes on sale. I'd like C&D to retest a production model to get it's times, if they can closely reproduce those numbers in similar conditions on the same track, then this car is underrated in the power department. If not, it was yet again another deceiving game that an automaker did with the pre-production model.


**Edit: After perusing a few stats in the luxury car comparison test C&D referenced, the Stinger got the exact same 1/4 mile time as the Cadillac CTS VSport that weighs almost identical in weight to the Stinger, also has 8 speed auto, similar overall gearing, but the Cadillac has 420 hp and 430 lbs ft of torque. And in the "top gear" rolling acceleration the Stinger even out accelerates the CTS by a smidge.

Another example is the Chevy SS sedan. It also achieves the same 12.9 @111 mph times with a 415 hp V8 in a car that weighs about 50 lbs lighter than the Stinger.

So again, this pre-pro Stinger is a ringer that the production models won't replicate, or Kia is vastly underrating this car's power output by the 10-12% I suggested above.

I thought of these same cars to compare with.

When I see 12.9 @ 111, those are two cars that come to mind.

[kevm14]

https://backfires.caranddriver.com/foru ... 104-546873

I want to see Kia develop a marketing campaign that truly resonates with the BMW (or Audi or Mercedes) buyer, if that is the the market Kia intends to capture. It cannot simply be about getting more for less. The $10k savings is just not that important to someone shopping a luxury product paid out over 3 - 5 years, compared to the loss of refinement, image, or sense of belonging to a club. I think Volvo does it best by being Volvo, focusing on Swedish design and safety with a few quirky performance models. The Japanese brands all have the same marketing mojo, and to a degree, styling and even logos, so that Acura/Lexus/Infiniti are psychologically interchangeable. I don't want Kia to become another Cadillac, whose sedans cannot seem to escape the old Cadillac brand identity no matter how well they perform.

I venture that 80% of Stingers will be 2.0T models and conquests will come more from family sedan buyers and first timer buyers considering entry luxury cars (320i, A4, CLA) than poaching from the top down.

I definitely think this car might end up like the V-sport. Great if you like used cars...which I do. But long term brand aspirations are a different story. At least Kia isn't a luxury brand.

So I take that all back. I definitely think this car might end up like the Chevrolet SS. Now THAT is a direct comparison. On the other hand, the Stinger is receiving a fair amount of marketing. Makes you wonder how the SS would have done with a marketing budget, even styled exactly the same. Without a doubt, better. I also just learned that GM had no lease deals on the SS. How many cars do you think in the $45k to $50k range are leased? The answer is: a lot.

[kevm14]

I do agree with this though.

Audi and BMW are getting lazy, no question there. I understand the strategy of design evolution to preserve brand identity and resale values, with a few wild cards (R8, Z4, TT) thrown in for excitement. Lately that evolution is too slow, or even a step backwards in the case of the latest A5 and A8.

However, the G70 could have an Infiniti or Acura badge on it and no one would be surprised. (I would say Lexus too, but that brand finally has a unique and cohesive design language, even if it is more origami than elegant to my eyes.) You cannot say that about any of the European brands or even Cadillac because they have all honed a recognizable design language over decades.

[Bob]

https://backfires.caranddriver.com/foru ... 104-546873

I want to see Kia develop a marketing campaign that truly resonates with the BMW (or Audi or Mercedes) buyer, if that is the the market Kia intends to capture. It cannot simply be about getting more for less. The $10k savings is just not that important to someone shopping a luxury product paid out over 3 - 5 years, compared to the loss of refinement, image, or sense of belonging to a club. I think Volvo does it best by being Volvo, focusing on Swedish design and safety with a few quirky performance models. The Japanese brands all have the same marketing mojo, and to a degree, styling and even logos, so that Acura/Lexus/Infiniti are psychologically interchangeable. I don't want Kia to become another Cadillac, whose sedans cannot seem to escape the old Cadillac brand identity no matter how well they perform.

I venture that 80% of Stingers will be 2.0T models and conquests will come more from family sedan buyers and first timer buyers considering entry luxury cars (320i, A4, CLA) than poaching from the top down.

I definitely think this car might end up like the V-sport. Great if you like used cars...which I do. But long term brand aspirations are a different story. At least Kia isn't a luxury brand.

So I take that all back. I definitely think this car might end up like the Chevrolet SS. Now THAT is a direct comparison. On the other hand, the Stinger is receiving a fair amount of marketing. Makes you wonder how the SS would have done with a marketing budget, even styled exactly the same. Without a doubt, better. I also just learned that GM had no lease deals on the SS. How many cars do you think in the $45k to $50k range are leased? The answer is: a lot.

I suspect the resale value of the Stinger as a percentage of original MSRP will be much worse than the SS and probably more in V-sport territory, though with a lower starting point.