Measured the voltage bias on the diode of the parts Simplicity alternator. 0.5174V. I don't really know what that means but I guess the diode is working in this one?
Now for some fun. I tried the new clamp meter.
Here are the Deutz headlights at full engine speed. Something under 10V but 4.46A which comes out to around 22W each. Not sure what the rated wattage is.
Simplicity headlights at full engine speed. 12.26V and 4.57A which comes out to 28W each.
And here is the charging situation. Looks like 1.93A which isn't particularly impressive.
My Simplicity seemed to charge the battery at like 16V. I may not have gotten a picture. Not sure that is right, either...
Garden tractor acquisition
Re: Garden tractor acquisition
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Re: Garden tractor acquisition
Guess what - Tractor Supply has a great selection of large sockets.
And here is the size I need. $10. Plus a $10 1/2" to 3/4" adapter. For double that I can have a whole 8 socket impact set. Still, had I known, maybe I would have just done that...
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Re: Garden tractor acquisition
Some quick research suggests that this won't work. Something about the alternator stator ground being grounded to the chassis. I might be able to make a floating ground and run separate ground wires but since the winding grounds are probably bounded together on the stator, that just might not work.
Plus it may also burn out the stator windings since the current should theoretically double (which I did actually consider and was will to take the risk). Maybe I should just diagnose and replace the inline diode and get back to original operating spec...
https://gardentractortalk.com/forums/to ... lternator/
Plus it may also burn out the stator windings since the current should theoretically double (which I did actually consider and was will to take the risk). Maybe I should just diagnose and replace the inline diode and get back to original operating spec...
https://gardentractortalk.com/forums/to ... lternator/
Re: Garden tractor acquisition
You can actually buy the harness pigtail with integrated diode.
https://www.partstree.com/parts/briggs- ... ts/393456/
I think I can replace a diode for a lot less than $15. In fact I can get like 20 diodes for $6.
https://www.partstree.com/parts/briggs- ... ts/393456/
I think I can replace a diode for a lot less than $15. In fact I can get like 20 diodes for $6.
Re: Garden tractor acquisition
Other research indicates that it could be a magnet problem. In which case I could swap the parts machine flywheel on. I guess I won't order anything until I can get that flywheel off, try the other alternator and test what I already have (including the diode on my existing alternator).
Sockets haven't come in yet so...
Sockets haven't come in yet so...
Re: Garden tractor acquisition
Really not sure about this in the long term but I crammed a fuel shutoff before the fuel filter. Maybe I should relocate the filter closer to the carb and leave the shutoff in this area. Or leave it alone. The filter is just resting on the starter now which I would assume will vibrate and possibly wear a hole in the filter eventually. Or maybe it will be fine. Now Bill can see what I meant by no room. Again there was no shutoff from the factory.
I ran it out of gas like the generator since I am still planning to take the carb back apart and polish the float valve seat. Now there will be very little fuel in the bowl when I do. Also did yet another oil change due to gas in the oil again. This time I just ran my usual Delo 400 15W-40. That Rotella 5W-40 seems so thin. I'll switch back before winter at which point everything should be straightened out anyway. I do need to do the plugs still, which will take 2 minutes.
I just noticed the starter is missing a bolt....great. Hope it is just missing and not snapped off. It seems to do OK with one bolt though so I guess worst case I could just leave it this way. I wanted to remove it and grease it though. I have a donor bolt from the other machine so as long as it isn't snapped off...
I ran it out of gas like the generator since I am still planning to take the carb back apart and polish the float valve seat. Now there will be very little fuel in the bowl when I do. Also did yet another oil change due to gas in the oil again. This time I just ran my usual Delo 400 15W-40. That Rotella 5W-40 seems so thin. I'll switch back before winter at which point everything should be straightened out anyway. I do need to do the plugs still, which will take 2 minutes.
I just noticed the starter is missing a bolt....great. Hope it is just missing and not snapped off. It seems to do OK with one bolt though so I guess worst case I could just leave it this way. I wanted to remove it and grease it though. I have a donor bolt from the other machine so as long as it isn't snapped off...
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Re: Garden tractor acquisition
Used my new 1-5/16" socket to break the flywheel nut loose on the Deutz. I had to really jam it in (and by that I mean mini-sledge it in) because the walls are thick and there isn't much clearance around the fan grill mount. That thin wall socket from TSC would have done me...
Though, spoiler alert, I was able to use the smaller nut from the parts machine that fits my 32mm socket upon reinstallation so I technically don't need the big sockets anymore...but I digress.
Here is the flywheel removed. It was a big fight. I had to heat up the flywheel with my torch and pound on the puller. Eventually it gave up and came off the crank, revealing the alternator stator. And, again, notice a missing bolt for the starter. Since I let it run out of gas in the carb last time, I decided to rebuild the starter before I started playing with the charging system. Well, not rebuild, but take apart, grease and reassemble. Same as when I did it on my Simplicity. Bendix close up. The first step is to drive that roll pin out to remove the Bendix and gear assembly from the shaft. Apparently my punch sucks as it kept bending. It is made in the USA and everything. Bendix and gear assembly removed. Remove long case screws which are 5/16". Remove bottom cover/brush holder, remove magnet housing and rotor. Clean all the things and grease. I used wheel bearing grease again. Reinstall magnet housing and rotor. Grease again... Brush holder routine. I used the same trick that worked last time. 2 3 penny nails per brush. Ziptie opposing brushes. Works great. Very little struggling this time. Then just slip the zip ties off, pull the nails and the brushes click onto the commutator.
I stole a starter bolt from the parts machine and it went in. No broken bolt apparently. Awesome. So nice to have this parts machine. To be continued.
Though, spoiler alert, I was able to use the smaller nut from the parts machine that fits my 32mm socket upon reinstallation so I technically don't need the big sockets anymore...but I digress.
Here is the flywheel removed. It was a big fight. I had to heat up the flywheel with my torch and pound on the puller. Eventually it gave up and came off the crank, revealing the alternator stator. And, again, notice a missing bolt for the starter. Since I let it run out of gas in the carb last time, I decided to rebuild the starter before I started playing with the charging system. Well, not rebuild, but take apart, grease and reassemble. Same as when I did it on my Simplicity. Bendix close up. The first step is to drive that roll pin out to remove the Bendix and gear assembly from the shaft. Apparently my punch sucks as it kept bending. It is made in the USA and everything. Bendix and gear assembly removed. Remove long case screws which are 5/16". Remove bottom cover/brush holder, remove magnet housing and rotor. Clean all the things and grease. I used wheel bearing grease again. Reinstall magnet housing and rotor. Grease again... Brush holder routine. I used the same trick that worked last time. 2 3 penny nails per brush. Ziptie opposing brushes. Works great. Very little struggling this time. Then just slip the zip ties off, pull the nails and the brushes click onto the commutator.
I stole a starter bolt from the parts machine and it went in. No broken bolt apparently. Awesome. So nice to have this parts machine. To be continued.
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Re: Garden tractor acquisition
I wanted to test the starter but not run it since the carb was still dry and I needed to take it apart. But to crank it I needed to install a flywheel. I removed the alternator and tested the diode. It had the same ~0.5V drop as the parts one. Hmm. So I started thinking about it. Both the AC and DC circuits were lower in amplitude than they should have been. I actually don't think the stator could cause that. It would have to be some other common cause. Like what? Like weak flywheel magnets.
I had to pull the parts machine flywheel again, so I did. It had lots of junk underneath so I blew that all out, and installed it on the Deutz, after reinstalling the stock alternator. Again, I used the smaller nut that fits my 32mm socket so that will make a future removal a little easier, at least loosening the nut. I used my impact to draw the flywheel down and seat it on the taper. After that, it was time to at least check the starter functionality without starting the engine. I cranked it and it sounds just as smooth and quiet as my Simplicity starter now. Such a difference. Very satisfying.
Since that was done, with the second bolt installed, I decided to tackle the carb. I had been planning to remove the carb but as luck would have it, all I had to do is remove the choke cable and pull the upper bowl housing off the carb with the carb still on the intake. This allowed me to work on the float seat. Side note, running the carb dry as I did (including choke at the end to see if I could suck all the fuel out) REALLY worked. It seemed totally dry in there. Didn't even really smell like gas. Now it turns out I could have left it fairly wet to just remove the upper housing but it's interesting anyway. Didn't even have to remove the fuel line (though I did before I realized the easier job this was going to be). Shot in the brass seat. I mixed up a little water with the valve grinding compound, stuck a Q-tip in my drill, soaked it in the mix and jammed it in with the drill on. I did that for a while...seemed shinier in there. I dunno. It must have smoothed it somewhat. Blew it all out with compressed air. I dunno, maybe it seals now. What I'll probably do is when it is time to change over to 5W-40 oil for winter, I will open the shut-off with a decent gas level in the tank and let it sit for a week or two. So I won't know if I really fixed it until the end of fall or whatever. Until then I'll use the shut-off religiously, just in case. After that I just reassembled which was really easy. Fortunately the gasket survived since it wasn't in there long. Next step, test!
I had to pull the parts machine flywheel again, so I did. It had lots of junk underneath so I blew that all out, and installed it on the Deutz, after reinstalling the stock alternator. Again, I used the smaller nut that fits my 32mm socket so that will make a future removal a little easier, at least loosening the nut. I used my impact to draw the flywheel down and seat it on the taper. After that, it was time to at least check the starter functionality without starting the engine. I cranked it and it sounds just as smooth and quiet as my Simplicity starter now. Such a difference. Very satisfying.
Since that was done, with the second bolt installed, I decided to tackle the carb. I had been planning to remove the carb but as luck would have it, all I had to do is remove the choke cable and pull the upper bowl housing off the carb with the carb still on the intake. This allowed me to work on the float seat. Side note, running the carb dry as I did (including choke at the end to see if I could suck all the fuel out) REALLY worked. It seemed totally dry in there. Didn't even really smell like gas. Now it turns out I could have left it fairly wet to just remove the upper housing but it's interesting anyway. Didn't even have to remove the fuel line (though I did before I realized the easier job this was going to be). Shot in the brass seat. I mixed up a little water with the valve grinding compound, stuck a Q-tip in my drill, soaked it in the mix and jammed it in with the drill on. I did that for a while...seemed shinier in there. I dunno. It must have smoothed it somewhat. Blew it all out with compressed air. I dunno, maybe it seals now. What I'll probably do is when it is time to change over to 5W-40 oil for winter, I will open the shut-off with a decent gas level in the tank and let it sit for a week or two. So I won't know if I really fixed it until the end of fall or whatever. Until then I'll use the shut-off religiously, just in case. After that I just reassembled which was really easy. Fortunately the gasket survived since it wasn't in there long. Next step, test!
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Re: Garden tractor acquisition
Of course it cranked and ran no problem.
First I tested the light circuit (AC) at full engine speed. Good news! It is up to 11V now. That is a huge improvement from like just under 9V. Still less than the 12V of my Simplicity but I think I can deal with 11V. They seemed brighter also. This confirms my theory. A stronger magnetic field will create a higher peak voltage...the alternator windings either work, or somehow shorted/open. Hard to figure how it would cause reduced output on both circuits. I also did some unloaded tests and these seemed better, too.
DC circuit:
17.19VAC 14.4VDC now. This is up from like 12.7V. I think my Simplicity still does better but I bet this will suffice. AC circuit:
13.7VAC. I think spec is like 14V but not sure if that's loaded or unloaded. Either way this is clearly an improvement. Side note, I also swapped the fan grill from the parts machine as it was not bent like the Deutz. It no longer grinds on the engine cover now. So that is awesome.
First I tested the light circuit (AC) at full engine speed. Good news! It is up to 11V now. That is a huge improvement from like just under 9V. Still less than the 12V of my Simplicity but I think I can deal with 11V. They seemed brighter also. This confirms my theory. A stronger magnetic field will create a higher peak voltage...the alternator windings either work, or somehow shorted/open. Hard to figure how it would cause reduced output on both circuits. I also did some unloaded tests and these seemed better, too.
DC circuit:
17.19VAC 14.4VDC now. This is up from like 12.7V. I think my Simplicity still does better but I bet this will suffice. AC circuit:
13.7VAC. I think spec is like 14V but not sure if that's loaded or unloaded. Either way this is clearly an improvement. Side note, I also swapped the fan grill from the parts machine as it was not bent like the Deutz. It no longer grinds on the engine cover now. So that is awesome.
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Re: Garden tractor acquisition
Then I swapped seats. Put the seat from the parts machine on the Deutz. Side by side before cleaning.
Cleaned with some Armor-All wipes. I may add some Gorilla tape up at the top...
After that I went after the wheel bearings. Sadly, these replacement wheels are not compatible with the OEM style bushing. The bushings are plastic and the wheel axle diameter is too small. So maybe I'll return them. At least I was able to grease them. Annoyed though since there is some slop and, well, I don't like steering slop.
Since that plan was a fail, I decided to continue and shorten the steering rod so I could thread the link on further, and center the steering wheel. Again, it needs to be centered because the rack limits travel at the left and right stops. So it had a different turning radius left and right which annoyed me, particularly since these aren't super modern tractors and don't turn super sharp like newer stuff seems to. Using my reciprocating saw I cut off like 3/8" at the end of the thread, filed it, and threaded the link back on. With it bottomed out, it was basically perfect. Steering is pretty well centered and it turns the same left and right (or close enough to it).
Oh, I put in my new NGK plugs also.
All in all, I did some great work on the machine today. At this point, it doesn't need a whole lot else except for maybe a couple things:
- The drive belt seems too long. I'm sure 80" is correct but perhaps due to some slop on the brake/clutch mechanism, it likes to fall off one of the tensioner pulleys after being disengaged. This is annoying and I have to kneel down, and place the belt against a tensioner pulley. The pedal also comes back too far upon engagement. I am thinking I should try a 79" belt. TSC carries the same belt in 79" though they were out of stock the last time I was there. Hopefully 1" shorter is not too much and ideally that will basically solve that. And I guess I would have a spare drive belt for my Simplicity since 80" seems to work fine there...unless my 80" belt was really an 81 or something odd. I guess I could try to check or go in the store to measure it. But I digress.
- Probably should wire brush and paint the frame area where the battery goes, like I did on my Simplicity.
That's really about it at this point. Anything like diff oil or hydro oil are things I haven't even done to my Simplicity so not sure what I will do, if anything.
After I get the belt sorted, I think it will be time to fit up the blower and frame and see how it runs. Grease stuff. Maybe unbend some bent stuff up in the blower.
But yeah, this is coming along very nicely. It has run well and started every time.
Off the top of my head, some parts I did buy:
- Flywheel puller. Tool for the toolbox...
- Plugs
- Air filter
- Fuel filter
- Drive belt
- Extra thrower belt
- Foam cushion for the lift lever...
- Carb kit
- Ignition coil
- Gas cap/level indicator
- Ring terminal for positive battery cable
- Fuel shut-off
- A bunch of oil before I got the fuel shut off...
- Drilled and tapped hole for throttle cable hold down, and new (larger) stainless bolt
- Fuel line from tank to shutoff, shutoff to filter and filter to carb
- Made hold down hardware out of threaded rod and new nuts for car battery (Group 75)
Seems like everything else was either just labor/tinkering, or parts from the parts machine. Pretty cool.
Oh, I put in my new NGK plugs also.
All in all, I did some great work on the machine today. At this point, it doesn't need a whole lot else except for maybe a couple things:
- The drive belt seems too long. I'm sure 80" is correct but perhaps due to some slop on the brake/clutch mechanism, it likes to fall off one of the tensioner pulleys after being disengaged. This is annoying and I have to kneel down, and place the belt against a tensioner pulley. The pedal also comes back too far upon engagement. I am thinking I should try a 79" belt. TSC carries the same belt in 79" though they were out of stock the last time I was there. Hopefully 1" shorter is not too much and ideally that will basically solve that. And I guess I would have a spare drive belt for my Simplicity since 80" seems to work fine there...unless my 80" belt was really an 81 or something odd. I guess I could try to check or go in the store to measure it. But I digress.
- Probably should wire brush and paint the frame area where the battery goes, like I did on my Simplicity.
That's really about it at this point. Anything like diff oil or hydro oil are things I haven't even done to my Simplicity so not sure what I will do, if anything.
After I get the belt sorted, I think it will be time to fit up the blower and frame and see how it runs. Grease stuff. Maybe unbend some bent stuff up in the blower.
But yeah, this is coming along very nicely. It has run well and started every time.
Off the top of my head, some parts I did buy:
- Flywheel puller. Tool for the toolbox...
- Plugs
- Air filter
- Fuel filter
- Drive belt
- Extra thrower belt
- Foam cushion for the lift lever...
- Carb kit
- Ignition coil
- Gas cap/level indicator
- Ring terminal for positive battery cable
- Fuel shut-off
- A bunch of oil before I got the fuel shut off...
- Drilled and tapped hole for throttle cable hold down, and new (larger) stainless bolt
- Fuel line from tank to shutoff, shutoff to filter and filter to carb
- Made hold down hardware out of threaded rod and new nuts for car battery (Group 75)
Seems like everything else was either just labor/tinkering, or parts from the parts machine. Pretty cool.
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