89 9C1 with 5.3 swap, then turbo
Posted: Sat Oct 10, 2015 10:40 am
http://ls1tech.com/forums/conversions-h ... e-9c1.html
This post brought to you by the Conversions & Hybrids sub-forum on LS1Tech.
I've seen some of these youtube videos before. Look how old this thread is! 2008. I'll track the build and results for the benefit of those who may be reading this thread:
He starts off saying he wants to just do a stock 5.3, and make sure everything is sorted out (like I definitely reiterated to Bill), and then do some kind of turbo setup down the road.
He is using a TH400, which would not be my choice. But, one thing I will say about the TH400 is it is very cheap to build something that will be reliable. That is the big benefit. I just could never, ever do a trans without OD, especially with his 3.42 gears (same as my Caprice). Later on he goes switch to a 4L80.
Reminder that he started with an L05 TBI, basically the exact same engine as my Caprice, minus a few horsepower.
He says he already has a turbo, from a 2004 Cummins 24V 5.9L. Wonder if he'll stick with this.
Looks like he had the car on the road with the N/A 5.3 inside of a month, which is pretty awesome.
Fast forward like 8 or 9 months and he's talking about his modified Fox Body headers, that he adapted to an LS1 header flange. Interesting. They are a shorty and are extremely compact, even better than manifolds apparently. The flanges are an actual GM LSx part number and they are quite thick. This pleases me. This is extremely important for long term sealing to the head, and especially with a forced induction application.
A status update from Sept, 2008:
In October, he comments that it pulls great to 6,000 rpm. This is a stock 5.3 with wimpy truck cam.
Update in Jan 2009, or about a year after he started:
March 2009:
He also goes onto say that he'll run the MAF until that maxes out its airflow calibration. Then he'll have to go speed density (MAP).
Fast forward to May 2012, he posts engine bay pics with a turbo. Basically once you switch from the driving N/A setup, going to the turbo will require a time investment, and you can only go so far before you have to take the car off the road to take care of all of the necessary details.
March 2013:
So the $64k question, aside from how it drives is, how fast is it?
April 2013:
Ugh, this is why I hate aftermarket parts sometimes.
August 2013:
Ok, big gap in time, over 2 years. Fast forward to late Sept 2015:
By the way, it looks like he's running a 67mm eBay turbo. Those stock diesel turbos I don't think are right for this kind of build. I know the Powerstroke turbo worked on the Rotsun but that was a light car with a much smaller engine.
Youtube vids:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFu4hlUTWSQ (I LOVE the idle quality and the sleeper mufflers. This is exactly what I want. With a 118 mph trap you don't need a rumpity rump to prove you are fast.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CXgXN7RJudg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5d0E9AgWPiQ
He threw some ET streets on it, and ran 11.4. I discount that as I would never drive around on that kind of tire. I fully accept the 12.0 ET and, more importantly, the 118 mph trap.
And that's it, to present. Cool build, good results. You can see how it becomes a long term thing. A bit of a labor of love. You chip away at it until it evolves into what you want (the idea of which will also evolve as you experience the car, and talk to people on the journey). Or maybe more accurately, chip away at solutions to achieve the goal. Every build is different and unless you are just totally aping someone else's work, you will have to figure stuff out. Which is, of course, satisfying.
This post brought to you by the Conversions & Hybrids sub-forum on LS1Tech.
I've seen some of these youtube videos before. Look how old this thread is! 2008. I'll track the build and results for the benefit of those who may be reading this thread:
He starts off saying he wants to just do a stock 5.3, and make sure everything is sorted out (like I definitely reiterated to Bill), and then do some kind of turbo setup down the road.
He is using a TH400, which would not be my choice. But, one thing I will say about the TH400 is it is very cheap to build something that will be reliable. That is the big benefit. I just could never, ever do a trans without OD, especially with his 3.42 gears (same as my Caprice). Later on he goes switch to a 4L80.
Reminder that he started with an L05 TBI, basically the exact same engine as my Caprice, minus a few horsepower.
He says he already has a turbo, from a 2004 Cummins 24V 5.9L. Wonder if he'll stick with this.
Looks like he had the car on the road with the N/A 5.3 inside of a month, which is pretty awesome.
Fast forward like 8 or 9 months and he's talking about his modified Fox Body headers, that he adapted to an LS1 header flange. Interesting. They are a shorty and are extremely compact, even better than manifolds apparently. The flanges are an actual GM LSx part number and they are quite thick. This pleases me. This is extremely important for long term sealing to the head, and especially with a forced induction application.
A status update from Sept, 2008:
Bill likes this I assume.Game plan is drive the Caprice until I get my 1990 Cavalier Z24 swap done. I'm putting a 3800 supercharged v6 with the 5speed trans. As soon as this is done (I have all parts, only got to get it done) Caprice will be back in the shop for the turbo install. I still need to find a waste gate & blow off valve, and some plumbing for intercooler, throttle body.
In October, he comments that it pulls great to 6,000 rpm. This is a stock 5.3 with wimpy truck cam.
Update in Jan 2009, or about a year after he started:
His big decision is how to proceed with engine management knowing he will be doing a turbo. He says he'd like realtime tuning, which the GM PCMs don't support. I would vote for the HP Tuners modified speed density OS, as most folks seem to get these to run great with reasonable effort. In other words, real time is not really necessary.I've been daily driving the caprice now since my last post. I'm actually pulling off close to 20 miles per gallon in it, worse when I feel like having some fun in it. Still no turbo on it, however I have gotten some more parts.
March 2009:
Daily driving! Bill, this is what I was talking about. You do the swap (which I admit isn't going to take 1 month) but then the car is on the road, reliable and, by the way, still quite fun. A stock 5.3 in a G-body is probably good for at least low 14s @ almost 100 mph. In 0-60 terms, that's probably mid-5's.This weekend the fuel system should be completed. I'm still driving this every day to work, so I'm trying to get one step at a time done during the weekend.
He also goes onto say that he'll run the MAF until that maxes out its airflow calibration. Then he'll have to go speed density (MAP).
Fast forward to May 2012, he posts engine bay pics with a turbo. Basically once you switch from the driving N/A setup, going to the turbo will require a time investment, and you can only go so far before you have to take the car off the road to take care of all of the necessary details.
March 2013:
Notice the manifolds. No headers here.Here's the build
180k 2000 5.3L
ARP Rod Bolts
Comp 225/255 @050, .598 lift 112? camshaft
Comp 918 Springs, Dbl Timing Set, Pushrods
Precision 67mm turbo billet wheel (pn 6766)
Precision 48mm wategate
Tial 50mm BOV
ebay intercooler, 12x24x4
Siemens 60lb injectors
4l80e trans, tci rebuild kit, hd2 shift kit, edge 10" converter
edelbrock victor jr with elbow, stock throttle body
stock truck manifolds, upside down and forward, welded to mild steel 2.5" mandrel tubing, v-bands so everything will disconnect for easy access. Downpipe is 3" mild steel, single 3 inch exhaust over the rear end, mandrel bent all the way out.
3.42 gears currently with open rear end, not so much fun, installing a posi rear end I removed from a 95 caprice 9c1. The stall is a bit much, going to see if I can get it tightened. No such thing as turbo lag on this thing. 10lbs as of right now.
So the $64k question, aside from how it drives is, how fast is it?
April 2013:
You just don't need a high stall converter with the kind of build he has. So much torque. Granted, he has gone to a pretty decent cam but appears to be stock heads.RCI 20 Gallon Cell, with sump, built in roll over valve, and fuel level sensor.
Holley Billet Series inline pump, part#12-890
Holley Billet Fuel Pressure Regulator, part#12-845
Holley Billet series filters, 100 micron pre pump, 10 micron post pump.
Holley Billet HP pressure regulator, boost/vac referenced.
-8 supply, -6 return.
Fuel cell is in the trunk, the sump drops through the floor of the trunk. Without a fuel tank back there underneath, I've got room for mufflers to make this thing even more of a sleeper.
The torque converter is coming out, going to try a stock one. I daily drive it and the converter is getting annoying. I might loose some of the quick spool, but right now I can't even keep traction as it is...so a tighter converter might actually make it better.
I'll get some recent pictures taken and uploaded soon.....
Ugh, this is why I hate aftermarket parts sometimes.
August 2013:
By November, he had the intake and TC back, ready to go in the car.had a slight issue with my Edelbrock Victor intake manifold, might have over torqued it, might just been crappy machine work on Edelbrock's part. The o-ring groove they cut to accept ls1 style intake gaskets, was very thin on one side, .050 thin. Other intake ports were .100 or more thick. Anyway, part chipped off and stuck to top of piston. Engine started knocking loudly, took it apart to find the aluminum chunk on my thumb in the picture stuck to top of the piston. I went a head and pulled engine out, and sent my torque converter back to have it re-stalled lower and install larger lockup lining (I might have burnt it a little bit)
Ok, big gap in time, over 2 years. Fast forward to late Sept 2015:
So 12 flat at 118 on street tires. That is basically ET and MPH identical to a CTS-V2 (the ones with 556 hp). Tell me that wouldn't be awesome. In a box Caprice.Just an update to any still following this, the Caprice is still running strong, no other mechanical failures to speak of other than the intake manifold issue...I've put about 15,000 miles on it in 2.5 years. I get about 12 mpg average with it. I've been to the race track a few times, and fastest I'm able to get down the track on 275/60/15 street tires is a 12.08 @ 118 mph. 4100 lbs.
here's a video of it after going back together fixing the intake.
By the way, it looks like he's running a 67mm eBay turbo. Those stock diesel turbos I don't think are right for this kind of build. I know the Powerstroke turbo worked on the Rotsun but that was a light car with a much smaller engine.
Youtube vids:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFu4hlUTWSQ (I LOVE the idle quality and the sleeper mufflers. This is exactly what I want. With a 118 mph trap you don't need a rumpity rump to prove you are fast.)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CXgXN7RJudg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5d0E9AgWPiQ
He threw some ET streets on it, and ran 11.4. I discount that as I would never drive around on that kind of tire. I fully accept the 12.0 ET and, more importantly, the 118 mph trap.
And that's it, to present. Cool build, good results. You can see how it becomes a long term thing. A bit of a labor of love. You chip away at it until it evolves into what you want (the idea of which will also evolve as you experience the car, and talk to people on the journey). Or maybe more accurately, chip away at solutions to achieve the goal. Every build is different and unless you are just totally aping someone else's work, you will have to figure stuff out. Which is, of course, satisfying.