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Firearms and other methods to protect your family

Posted: Thu Mar 31, 2016 7:50 am
by kevm14
Concern: B&E.

Overwhelming majority are when you are known/thought to be not home. For the times when they know you are home, you're looking at something very different from a standard burglary, and you've been targeted. What can you do to protect yourself in these situations, and what are the consequences of being ready or taking action? False alarms, not being able to pull the trigger, not actually being ready even though you are sure you have it all planned out.

My opinion: Get a dog or some alarm stickers/signs.

Discuss.

Re: Firearms and other methods to protect your family

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2016 9:13 am
by .22lr
Assumptions:
1) A “home invasion” is the act of a criminal entering an occupied dwelling.
2) “Self-defense” is the LEGAL use of force (up to and including deadly force) to protect yourself or other innocent persons. I’ll be going by Massachusetts law for two reasons: 1) It’s what I’m familiar with 2) Rhode Island is a silly place, filled with silly people, governed by silly laws.
Massachusetts jury instructions on self-defense are located at:
http://www.mass.gov/courts/docs/courts- ... efense.pdf
Page 6 of 23 covers the “castle doctrine” which alleviates the duty to retreat. It does not alleviate ANY other requirement of lawful self defense
**********
1) Layers of Defense:
a. 1st layer – deterrence. “If you don’t want to get eaten, don’t look like lunch.” A house which is well lit , visible from the street, appears to have alarms, strong doors etc. is less attractive than the isolated house with non-functioning lights and sliding glass doors.
b. 2nd layer – access controls. This all boils down to keeping people out… for a while. All homes can be forcibly entered. This cannot be stopped. Good locks in solid doors in solid frames buy you time. Sliding glass doors are a home invasion express entrance to any criminal who has discovered rocks.
c. 3rd layer – situational awareness. Contrary to popular belief, humans are oblivious to most of what goes on around us. Being hyper vigilant is exhausting and cannot be maintained long term. Alarms allow us to alert to potential danger.
d. 4th layer – help. AKA, call for men with guns, AKA call the cops. They bring friends and are just dripping in qualified immunity… you are not.
e. Last layer – physical defense, flight or surrender. Once they have crashed through the outer layers, this is the last one. The bad people have demonstrated resolve in kicking in doors, ignoring alarms, and disregarded your shouts of “the police are on the way.” The laws of self-defense *might* now come into play. Surrender to determined criminals and hope for the best doesn’t seem to grand of an idea.

2) Elements in justifiable self-defense (Lawful use of force)
a. Innocence – You cannot have started or incited the attack.
b. Reasonable Apprehension - You can articulate how the appearance actions or speech of your assailant would make a “reasonable man” (as defined by case law) fear that they were about to come under attack that would cause death or grave bodily injury.
i. Disparity of force
c. Duty to Retreat – you MUST attempt to SAFELY avoid use of force
i. Castle Doctrine lessens this duty.
d. Reasonable Force - deadly force cannot be used to counter non-deadly force (except in cases where the disparity of force [size, skill, or number of assailants ] exists). The severity of an unarmed attack determines deadly vs. non deadly unarmed force (a slap in the face vice slamming the head into an object).
e. Imminence – Unless force is used RIGHT NOW, will result in the innocent party’s death or grave bodily injury.

3) Willingness to use violence
a. Your opponent gets the first vote. If they have entered your home forcibly, not run when they realize the dwelling Is occupied… they are intent on causing you harm.
b. You get a vote. You can trust your family’s safety to the benevolence of the gents mentioned in 3a; I don’t feel that is a good plan. Does your family’s worth exceed your aversion to using violence? Everyone’s answer is different. This is a HUGE component of self-defense, armed or otherwise. Attempting to make this determination while facing unknown men in your home is unwise; it needs to be thoughtfully considered well in advance.
c. You get 2 votes (you’re special!). Training. Training is the best a law abiding citizen can get to practicing self-defense. Bad people practice by hurting people, good people don’t. Owning a firearm / bat / knife and assuming the needed skills will materialize is like buying a piano and considering yourself prepared to play in an orchestra. Good training will cement your skills, great training will shatter your preconceptions.
d. You get 3 votes (You’re a democrat?) Determination. You will likely be injured. There is a high possibility that your injury will be grave. You aren’t superman, and people are annoyingly resilient. Predetermine your goals. Be realistic. If your goal is ensure the safety of your spouse and children, realize what that leaves out and if you can accept that cost.
4) I have no four

Re: Firearms and other methods to protect your family

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2016 11:15 am
by kevm14
How do you feel about shotguns in the context of this discussion? And by that I mean, the home owner's use of one as defense.

Re: Firearms and other methods to protect your family

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2016 12:19 pm
by .22lr
In regards to shotguns, with:
1) PROPER TRAINING
2) Appropriate ammunition selection (#1 or 00 buck, or reduced recoil, penetration limited slugs)
3) Prior selection of "safe" firing directions (Try not to shoot towards neighbors... it's rude!)
4) Realistic view of its pro's and cons, weight, recoil, mobility, etc

A shotgun can be excellent for home defense. It shines in the "get everyone into the "safe" room and wait for the cops to arrive category.

A particular benefit is the low cost of the typical 12 gauge pump (20 gauge is great too, with less weight and lower recoil )

That being said, the modern carbine (specifically in .223rem / 5.45x55mm) has a lot of positives and is easier for smaller statured folks as well.

On the off hand chance the question is one of proportionality of force, neither I nor the law have issue; so long as there exists a deadly threat to the defender's life that meets the legal requirements of self defense.

Re: Firearms and other methods to protect your family

Posted: Fri Apr 01, 2016 2:53 pm
by dochielomn
kevm14 wrote:Concern: B&E.

Overwhelming majority are when you are known/thought to be not home. For the times when they know you are home, you're looking at something very different from a standard burglary, and you've been targeted. What can you do to protect yourself in these situations, and what are the consequences of being ready or taking action? False alarms, not being able to pull the trigger, not actually being ready even though you are sure you have it all planned out.

My opinion: Get a dog or some alarm stickers/signs.

Discuss.
From everything/anything that I've read/heard, it would appear that majority of B&E are going to occur because the person(s) responsible think you're not home and the noise level isn't going to alarm others in the area. So for instance, a dog barking might deter your average or typical potential burglar because why bother with the hassle knowing that a) the dog is going to create a loud enough noise that might get a neighbor to at least look to see what's going on or b) a dog might actually attack and then you have to deal with that or potential for some form of evidence to be left behind that could eventually lead an arrest. So overall, I'm in favor of the dog approach. Then again, I am biased as I grew up with a German Shepherd who was very protective (an example- my parents tell a story of our dog at only 8-10 weeks old, and us only having him for a week or two, growling at a plumber that came over to fix something) and loved to bark at people he did not recognize and if a stranger entered, he would have attacked.

But also, if the potential burglar knows you're home and still chooses to enter, then there is something in the house that they want desperately and don't care or they intend to also inflict harm upon you as well.