Here are some more things:
Turbo inlet boot (x2): A2780941691
https://www.mercedesbenzpartsshop.com/o ... 2780941691
At $39/ea maybe I'll just see what condition mine are. This can be done later if something is torn or something.
Centrifuge breather cover: A2780100431
https://www.mercedesbenzpartsshop.com/o ... 2780100431
Only $111 and actually in stock so I'll do this.
Breather cover vent line that I want to research (probably not replacing unless it has a check valve in it): A2780180212
Not going to do this one.
14 E63S: thermostat stuck open
Re: 14 E63S: thermostat stuck open
I've got everything in hand that I ordered. Should be ready. Also, I've done the job in my head a number of times at this point so I think it's time. Well, maybe Saturday I mean.
Re: 14 E63S: thermostat stuck open
Oil filter housing thermostat parts
cover A2781800438
Thermostat A2781800175
Spring A1199931001
cover A2781800438
Thermostat A2781800175
Spring A1199931001
Re: 14 E63S: thermostat stuck open
I will have to come back with a more in depth reply. This job was very time consuming and had many steps that just took forever to complete. As a result of taking the whole weekend I really didn't get too many photos but I can definitely get some after the fact, and I will.
For now, here are some highlights:
- Adam came over on Sat and we started (meaning rearrange cars and lift up E63) a little after 10am
- There was a long errand that required me to go to the MB dealer twice (same trip fortunately) as well as HF. This probably took up 90 minutes easily, but fortunately Adam was able to remove the WP in this time.
- He left around....7:30pm? And I kept working until 8pm or something around there.
- Sunday I started around 9:15am. 2 hour break in the early afternoon for more job-related errands plus I brought Ian to lunch.
- Finished around 7:30pm again. Showered, and test drove around 8:30pm. Car seems good but will have to keep my eye on the things I touched to make sure nothing weird develops that I have to get back into
- The number of bolts touched for this job was pretty ridiculous, including M6, M7, M8, probably M10s, torx head, E-head, some hex head. I ended up with around 3 bolts left over so time will tell if this impacts anything. I don't know where they go.
- Adam effortlessly and unintentionally snapped off various plastic stuff when dealing with the WP, thus proving that you absolutely CANNOT replace the WP without doing the left side turbo coolant lines. I had planned for this fortunately.
- Despite draining the radiator at the bottom, removal of the WP and some hoses released even more coolant which was annoying.
- A very slippery coolant and oil puddle formed on the garage floor. We had creepers but we were still stepping in it and slipping.
As far as major steps that were frustrating or took way longer than they should have:
- Fan removal. I expected this to be easy but it was a bit of a fight. Two main reasons. One, there are some pipes secured to the plastic fan shroud at the bottom with coarse thread bolts. Three. Access to the passenger side one was very difficult and ultimately required dealing with the lower radiator hose (which has multiple Ts/Ys on it). The 1/4" drive torx drivers I bought at HF did make reinstall easier. Two, unclipping the upper part of the fan shroud/housing from this plastic that sits over the radiator took a lot of fiddling and probably already had some broken tabs. We also had to pry the radiator rearward by the upper mounts an uncomfortable amount. I hope the radiator doesn't spring a leak.
- Adam reported that access to some WP bolts was very tricky and exacerbated by my particular hand tool availability. He said the torx bits I bought at HF would help immensely.
- Access to the lower oil filter housing bolts requires bending the left turbo coolant lines out of the way. This didn't take an hour but each thing like this adds time. When a single fastener removal goes from the expected 5 seconds to 5-15 minutes, you can see how this does add up over the entire job.
- An online video from DC Motorworks says the oil thermostat cover on the oil filter housing is a source of leaks. Mine was only just a little wet but I decided to add this to the job. I asked Adam to try removal and then I could use a new O-ring from an assortment, but he broke it as expected. The cover is available, however, I could not purchase it locally. Did not feel like rolling the dice on Tiverton which had 1 and would have been another 90+ minute boondoggle. So instead I bought an ENTIRE oil filter housing assembly from MB Warwick for $220 retail. It comes with the oil thermostat, gasket (which I bought already, sigh), and even an oil filter preinstalled. This added time and additional cost to the job, but at least more cost/less time than if I had driven to Viti for the cheap thermostat cover.
- As I said before, the number of fasteners, 2 stage torque in many cases, and CONSTANT math on Nm to lb-ft (or inch pounds) was a source of delay. Tiny bolts into aluminum means you want to break out the torque wrench. Risk of under/over torquing is not insignificant.
- My coolant hose R&D was incomplete despite my best efforts off the car (I mean the lower, longer hose that goes around the WP pulley, over the crank pulley and under, not over, the belt - the upper hose I had already cut to length and was perfect). This alone must have added 90 minutes or more to the job from running around and trying different things to keep the hose out of contact with the WP pulley, crank pulley and serpentine belt. Turns out this must be why Mercedes used the crappy plastic hoses. They are very compact and are also molded to fit right around the areas of interference to maintain the tightest engine packaging possible. I ended up using a different bolt hole after struggling with my intended bolt hole and that would have cut out pretty much the entire 90 minute delay if I had tried that first. I have not seen any threads on how to do this plastic hose bypass with a coolant hose. Only someone who showed the assembled part but nothing further (i.e. tips and tricks during fitment, resolutions, overall experience, etc.). So I will be making a post and probably pretty forward leaning (just like unplugging the oil solenoid).
- I had to chase SEVERAL bolt holes with a tap (M6 and M8), for accessory pullies and misc support bracketry. One or two in the oil filter housing and one in the WP.
- Fan reinstall was generally easier than removal as Adam predicted but still took a bit of time to finagle all of the nonsense. And screw in those lower pipe holders.
- I had analysis paralysis on a few occasions when I wasn't sure what order to reinstall parts. This proved to be a rational fear when I had to disconnect the oil cooler pipes TWICE from the oil filter housing, as well as remove a line support bracket that I had installed, just so I could tighten a hose clamp on the left boost pipe. The number of nested instructions on this job is comical.
- The left turbo inlet pipe was a BEAR. It just would not slip over the turbo. I tried all kinds of things and ended up not only expanding the pipe segments, but placing the rubber gasket on the turbo first seemed to be the trick, rather than placing it on the pipe first and then trying to slide the hole thing onto the turbo. This was in spite of liberal amounts of WD-40. Ian can attest to the frustration and creative prying I attempted (like on the plastic fan shroud and radiator - ugh). The hose clamp started stripping but hopefully it was more of a torque limit and it will hold a load acceptably.
- After I was done I realized that I didn't replace the dust cover to the big upper accessory pulley. Looking more closely at the pulley I realized it was in backwards. Fortunately I was able to release belt tension, buzz the pulley off with my power ratchet, flip it around, buzz it back on, and slip the belt back over. And the dust cap snapped on fine. This actually didn't take too long because Ian was able to hold the tensioner back while I did the pulley but is just another example of time added.
I could comment on each individual step further but yeah this was a lot even though it seems pretty routine.
As a recap of what the car actually needed:
- A thermostat
Technically that's it. But, the WP pulley had migrated forward in the bearing at least 0.25" and I think the belt was starting to not fully engage with the pulley at the back. So it also needed a WP. To do the WP, you must break all the coolant lines. Mine were fragile but NOT leaking. The WP was also not leaking yet. To do the coolant lines it makes sense to remove the charge piping. Once you do that you have easy access to the accessory pullies, oil filter housing and oil cooler.
That said, I think the belt was fine, the pullies were fine, and nothing was leaking at the oil filter housing, oil cooler or coolant lines. Given the relative ease of doing just the thermostat, while I could have just thrown a thermostat in and moved on, I would have been back in soon to do the WP and turbo coolant lines, and there is a good chance the thermostat would have broken inside the WP, which is another $270, plus ALL of the work I just summarized. Why do that?
For now, here are some highlights:
- Adam came over on Sat and we started (meaning rearrange cars and lift up E63) a little after 10am
- There was a long errand that required me to go to the MB dealer twice (same trip fortunately) as well as HF. This probably took up 90 minutes easily, but fortunately Adam was able to remove the WP in this time.
- He left around....7:30pm? And I kept working until 8pm or something around there.
- Sunday I started around 9:15am. 2 hour break in the early afternoon for more job-related errands plus I brought Ian to lunch.
- Finished around 7:30pm again. Showered, and test drove around 8:30pm. Car seems good but will have to keep my eye on the things I touched to make sure nothing weird develops that I have to get back into
- The number of bolts touched for this job was pretty ridiculous, including M6, M7, M8, probably M10s, torx head, E-head, some hex head. I ended up with around 3 bolts left over so time will tell if this impacts anything. I don't know where they go.
- Adam effortlessly and unintentionally snapped off various plastic stuff when dealing with the WP, thus proving that you absolutely CANNOT replace the WP without doing the left side turbo coolant lines. I had planned for this fortunately.
- Despite draining the radiator at the bottom, removal of the WP and some hoses released even more coolant which was annoying.
- A very slippery coolant and oil puddle formed on the garage floor. We had creepers but we were still stepping in it and slipping.
As far as major steps that were frustrating or took way longer than they should have:
- Fan removal. I expected this to be easy but it was a bit of a fight. Two main reasons. One, there are some pipes secured to the plastic fan shroud at the bottom with coarse thread bolts. Three. Access to the passenger side one was very difficult and ultimately required dealing with the lower radiator hose (which has multiple Ts/Ys on it). The 1/4" drive torx drivers I bought at HF did make reinstall easier. Two, unclipping the upper part of the fan shroud/housing from this plastic that sits over the radiator took a lot of fiddling and probably already had some broken tabs. We also had to pry the radiator rearward by the upper mounts an uncomfortable amount. I hope the radiator doesn't spring a leak.
- Adam reported that access to some WP bolts was very tricky and exacerbated by my particular hand tool availability. He said the torx bits I bought at HF would help immensely.
- Access to the lower oil filter housing bolts requires bending the left turbo coolant lines out of the way. This didn't take an hour but each thing like this adds time. When a single fastener removal goes from the expected 5 seconds to 5-15 minutes, you can see how this does add up over the entire job.
- An online video from DC Motorworks says the oil thermostat cover on the oil filter housing is a source of leaks. Mine was only just a little wet but I decided to add this to the job. I asked Adam to try removal and then I could use a new O-ring from an assortment, but he broke it as expected. The cover is available, however, I could not purchase it locally. Did not feel like rolling the dice on Tiverton which had 1 and would have been another 90+ minute boondoggle. So instead I bought an ENTIRE oil filter housing assembly from MB Warwick for $220 retail. It comes with the oil thermostat, gasket (which I bought already, sigh), and even an oil filter preinstalled. This added time and additional cost to the job, but at least more cost/less time than if I had driven to Viti for the cheap thermostat cover.
- As I said before, the number of fasteners, 2 stage torque in many cases, and CONSTANT math on Nm to lb-ft (or inch pounds) was a source of delay. Tiny bolts into aluminum means you want to break out the torque wrench. Risk of under/over torquing is not insignificant.
- My coolant hose R&D was incomplete despite my best efforts off the car (I mean the lower, longer hose that goes around the WP pulley, over the crank pulley and under, not over, the belt - the upper hose I had already cut to length and was perfect). This alone must have added 90 minutes or more to the job from running around and trying different things to keep the hose out of contact with the WP pulley, crank pulley and serpentine belt. Turns out this must be why Mercedes used the crappy plastic hoses. They are very compact and are also molded to fit right around the areas of interference to maintain the tightest engine packaging possible. I ended up using a different bolt hole after struggling with my intended bolt hole and that would have cut out pretty much the entire 90 minute delay if I had tried that first. I have not seen any threads on how to do this plastic hose bypass with a coolant hose. Only someone who showed the assembled part but nothing further (i.e. tips and tricks during fitment, resolutions, overall experience, etc.). So I will be making a post and probably pretty forward leaning (just like unplugging the oil solenoid).
- I had to chase SEVERAL bolt holes with a tap (M6 and M8), for accessory pullies and misc support bracketry. One or two in the oil filter housing and one in the WP.
- Fan reinstall was generally easier than removal as Adam predicted but still took a bit of time to finagle all of the nonsense. And screw in those lower pipe holders.
- I had analysis paralysis on a few occasions when I wasn't sure what order to reinstall parts. This proved to be a rational fear when I had to disconnect the oil cooler pipes TWICE from the oil filter housing, as well as remove a line support bracket that I had installed, just so I could tighten a hose clamp on the left boost pipe. The number of nested instructions on this job is comical.
- The left turbo inlet pipe was a BEAR. It just would not slip over the turbo. I tried all kinds of things and ended up not only expanding the pipe segments, but placing the rubber gasket on the turbo first seemed to be the trick, rather than placing it on the pipe first and then trying to slide the hole thing onto the turbo. This was in spite of liberal amounts of WD-40. Ian can attest to the frustration and creative prying I attempted (like on the plastic fan shroud and radiator - ugh). The hose clamp started stripping but hopefully it was more of a torque limit and it will hold a load acceptably.
- After I was done I realized that I didn't replace the dust cover to the big upper accessory pulley. Looking more closely at the pulley I realized it was in backwards. Fortunately I was able to release belt tension, buzz the pulley off with my power ratchet, flip it around, buzz it back on, and slip the belt back over. And the dust cap snapped on fine. This actually didn't take too long because Ian was able to hold the tensioner back while I did the pulley but is just another example of time added.
I could comment on each individual step further but yeah this was a lot even though it seems pretty routine.
As a recap of what the car actually needed:
- A thermostat
Technically that's it. But, the WP pulley had migrated forward in the bearing at least 0.25" and I think the belt was starting to not fully engage with the pulley at the back. So it also needed a WP. To do the WP, you must break all the coolant lines. Mine were fragile but NOT leaking. The WP was also not leaking yet. To do the coolant lines it makes sense to remove the charge piping. Once you do that you have easy access to the accessory pullies, oil filter housing and oil cooler.
That said, I think the belt was fine, the pullies were fine, and nothing was leaking at the oil filter housing, oil cooler or coolant lines. Given the relative ease of doing just the thermostat, while I could have just thrown a thermostat in and moved on, I would have been back in soon to do the WP and turbo coolant lines, and there is a good chance the thermostat would have broken inside the WP, which is another $270, plus ALL of the work I just summarized. Why do that?
Re: 14 E63S: thermostat stuck open
A few pics to share
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