Since this H2H was about track packs ... I guess track times are relevant to figure out who's better then ... You can think th interior is better, but THAT is irrelevant to determine who's better at the track ...
So, few thoughts about this competition:
Is Ford so crappy that they can't beat a heavy older car? Anyone could beat it, just need to want it and put the price on it.
So why Ford failed? Because Mustang sold its soul to globalization. I think it's all the point here.
We knew that from the first look at the car. I can understand some people liking its look, but I think no one would deny the fact this is not an american pony/muscle car look anymore; They have chosen to sell the car worldwide, and designed it this way, with this euro/japanese/worldwide look.
Then they sold their hearts with that shameful 4 banger.
So why aim at Camaro? why aim at a true american car? I think Ford couldn't care less about getting their a** kicked by a Camaro. They want to beat GM only in sales.
To me, this test is relevant to the fact Ford isn't an american brand anymore.
Being european, living in europe and driving a Camaro 1LE, I can tell you people LOVE my car. Almost all of them, I get thumbs up and smiles all the time. Still, none of these people would buy this car.
I may be mistaken but I'm feeling the global Mustang will be a fail too (at least in europe) because even if mustang is famous, people still have this feeling american cars are crappy. The car looks european, seems to drive european but is not european.
To me, the muscle car war isn't dead but changed fighters. on the field is now only Camaro and Chally. Mustang is now nothing more than a fusion coupe.
I won't even care anymore about Mustang's reviews. different planets, differents areas.
Unless the 2016 Camaro follows that shameful path Mustang just opened
Being honest, being in France, when I see a Mustang and when a Mustang sees my Camaro, we flash lights and wave at each others. We feel like part of a single family, the family of american cars lovers. We do the same with Corvettes.
I can tell you that I won't flash any lights when seeing a new Mustang. This car is definitely not part of the family. with global sales, look and engines, it will just be some kinda other volkswagen to us ...
Head 2 Head - Mustang GT vs. Camaro SS
Re: Head 2 Head - Mustang GT vs. Camaro SS
An actual European weighs in with some pretty insightful commentary:
Re: Head 2 Head - Mustang GT vs. Camaro SS
A reminder that each year, the Camaro evolved:
Not saying the Mustang didn't, but it also suggests the MY16 Camaro isn't going to debut with all of these models available.The 5th gen came out as a 2010, 2011 was the convertible, 2012 the ZL1, 2013 ZL1 convertible & 1LE, 2014 restyle & Z/28.
Re: Head 2 Head - Mustang GT vs. Camaro SS
Awesome, Europe hates the European Mustang. Somebody tell GM so they don't drive the Camaro into this land mine.
GM could really destroy the Mustang if the Gen 6 looks exactly like a combination of the 2010 and the 2014 Camaro, with Camaro/Corvette Stingray style rear lights.
The Gen 6 is lighter and should handle better that the Gen 5, which handles better than the new Fusestang.
If GM continues to make it look like an American Muscle car, it will be much better than the new Mustang.
I have to say current pics of the new Camaro are awful.
GM could really destroy the Mustang if the Gen 6 looks exactly like a combination of the 2010 and the 2014 Camaro, with Camaro/Corvette Stingray style rear lights.
The Gen 6 is lighter and should handle better that the Gen 5, which handles better than the new Fusestang.
If GM continues to make it look like an American Muscle car, it will be much better than the new Mustang.
I have to say current pics of the new Camaro are awful.
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Re: Head 2 Head - Mustang GT vs. Camaro SS
Aren't those just random renderings based on assumptions?
Re: Head 2 Head - Mustang GT vs. Camaro SS
I didn't know this.
Now if you buy the 1LE bits for a 2010, does that bring it up to 1LE handling? Or do you need to start with a 2012 FE4? My CTS-V has FE4 suspension btw.The FE4 suspension was never a "performance option." The 2010 & 2011 Camaro used the FE3 suspension, then in 2012 GM changed ALL Camaro's to the FE4 suspension. I had mentioned this earlier in the thread along with what the changes included.
The FE4 suspension address major complaints that were brought up in auto reviews of poor handling, and as a former owner of a 2010 Camaro I can confirm that the Change definitely made a huge difference. A 2010-2011 Camaro compared to a 2012+ Camaro feels much difference in the handling department.
Re: Head 2 Head - Mustang GT vs. Camaro SS
I wish that you were right and that they were random generated possibilities.
They are actually based on the new Transformers movie. That may sound dumb, but the actual gen 5 production Camaro looked extremely close to the Camaro in the movie.
Check this out:
http://www.autonews.com/article/2014062 ... mers-flick
They are actually based on the new Transformers movie. That may sound dumb, but the actual gen 5 production Camaro looked extremely close to the Camaro in the movie.
Check this out:
http://www.autonews.com/article/2014062 ... mers-flick
Re: Head 2 Head - Mustang GT vs. Camaro SS
Also, as far as the 1LE suspension upgrade, here is what I found:
Difference between FE3 and FE4 suspension is stiffer struts and bigger sway bars front and rear.
The 1LE conversion kit comes with shocks, struts and sway bars, so you shouldn't have to go FE4 first.
Also, the marketing specifically says:
Details: Give your 2010 and newer Camaro greater capability in curves with the same suspension components used in the production 1LE performance package. Contents include front and rear stabilizer bars, front struts, rear shock absorbers, ZL1 wheel bearings, toe links, and rear shock mounts for better handling and performance.
I don't have measurements of the 1LE pack though to compare.
Difference between FE3 and FE4 suspension is stiffer struts and bigger sway bars front and rear.
The 1LE conversion kit comes with shocks, struts and sway bars, so you shouldn't have to go FE4 first.
Also, the marketing specifically says:
Details: Give your 2010 and newer Camaro greater capability in curves with the same suspension components used in the production 1LE performance package. Contents include front and rear stabilizer bars, front struts, rear shock absorbers, ZL1 wheel bearings, toe links, and rear shock mounts for better handling and performance.
I don't have measurements of the 1LE pack though to compare.
Re: Head 2 Head - Mustang GT vs. Camaro SS
I want to meet this guy and shake his hand for being awesome.
The difference is GM has some of the best suspension guys in the industry and they are being turned lose to do things they were never permitted to do in the past. The Z/28 is an example of this as the old GM would have never permitted such a car.
The ace on the Camaro has been Mark Stielow. He is the wizard who turned the old Holden chassis into the Z/28. He also is the one who did the Cobalt SS turbo and HHR SS turbo and made them as fast or faster than much more expensive cars with larger engines.
I expect Mark has been given a free hand on the new Camaro. In this case he will be starting out from the start with a better more up to date suspension and will tune it right from the start vs. just fixing older designs like he has been doing.
Too many people have been fooled to think the secret to the latest Camaro's ahs been special tires. Well several magazines have debunked this and learned that while they play a part it is a small part as the cars lose little time on harder rubber.
This only make me expect 1LE handling on the next SS or even better.